The 3rd Person of the Trinity is Jesus Christ's Father?
Let' talk about he three fathers of baby Jesus the man Jesus. Over the course of the past decade or so I've had the opportunity to see quite a variety of trinitarian responses to questions about baby Jesus birth and there's quite a spectrum of things that you'll see from trinitarians on this matter. Depending on what the question or what the point of debate is, it would be a little bit too complicated to explain here.I've seen debates where trinitarians have been cornered into insisting that really the man Jesus didn't even have a father, okay the son of God has a father but that God the son came down from heaven and just assumed this human nature. So this person doesn't really have a father per se. One of the ways they get caught in that response is when they start trying to argue that God begets God and ideas like that. Whatever is begotten of God is God.
The Bible says spirit begets spirit and flesh begets flesh so how did the spirit begets the flesh baby Jesus? You see and that's where they sort of corner themselves because they start arguing that way in a corner. On the flipside and on the other extreme end you'll have a situation where trinitarians are cornered into admitting Jesus had three fathers, and that happens when they start pointing out that the Holy Spirit begat baby Jesus. Because the Bible says that and once they've admitted that, being begotten means being fathered, which it does. The Holy Spirit begats baby Jesus, they kind of catch themselves once in a while. They have the Holy Spirit fathering Jesus and they have the third person of the trinity as Jesus father and they have the first person of the trinity as Jesus father. Then they end up with Joseph being Jesus adopted father. See John 6:42
It's hard to sort of even imagine what goes on in the trinitarian mind when it comes to this question because it gets very strange, the Bible says that baby Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit or begotten out of the Holy Spirit in Matt 1:18 and Luke 1:35. The word begotten might not be in some of your translations but it's in the Greek, see Luke 1:35. When you see the opening words of Matthew for example, Abraham begat Isaac, Isaac begat Jacob, Jacob begat Judah, and so on. You'll see some translations translate that as Abraham fathered Isaac, Isaac fathered Jacob, Jacob fathered Judah etc and that essentially captures what the word begat or begotten means. It means to procreate or be the pro creator of the one responsible for giving birth to from the father's perspective. When the Bible says the Holy Spirit begat Jesus and you're a trinitarian you have the third person of the trinity as the father of Jesus which makes no sense. Because in trinity world in your own doctrine you don't believe that the Holy Spirit is the father of Jesus, yet the Bible says the Holy Spirit fathered Jesus.
The only way this is going to make sense is, if the Holy Spirit isn't a separate third person and the Holy Spirit is simply the Father's spirit. Now those passages are going to make sense if you say that Yahweh is the Father of Jesus even though the spirit begat or fathered baby Jesus. But as it is in trinity world you've got the third person of the trinity fathering Jesus so you can't escape the fact that, that means the Holy Spirit is the father of Jesus. Because you're in your trinitarian world and the Holy Spirit is a separate person from the Father, and then you've got Yahweh the Father as the Father of Jesus even though somebody else, the third person of the trinity fathered him, begot him. You see how that makes absolutely no sense at all. To end up with three fathers Joseph is the adopted father the Holy Spirit who begot him fathered him, and then somehow you have to admit that the Father Yahweh the first person in the trinity is the father of Jesus. You might also end up with Jesus began Jesus because in the trinity doctrine the three persons or so called persons are co equal and the same substance. If you're going to believe the Holy Spirit is a separate third person fathered Jesus or begot Jesus you got a huge problem on your hands.
I know what most Trinitarians do, they go weird in their heads, they start thinking about a solution to this problem an excuse and instead of saying you know this is a serious problem. I got to check this out to see what's going on here, instead of doing that, their first reaction most of the time with most people is to dream up an excuse and make something up. What they'll do is they'll use the language of the trinity, first person and the third person, but they'll try to describe it in the way that it really happened. It was the Father's Holy Spirit. His Holy Spirit is not a separate third person. Yahweh is who He is, He is Spirit and that is what the Father is. Our Holy Father is Holy Spirit and so they'll try to describe it with that truth by using trinitarian language. To try to get out of their problem it's kind of weird. What they do in their head is like they're admitting that they're wrong without admitting that they're wrong. It's kind of the same thing they do with the singular personal pronouns of Yahweh, they don't want to admit singular personal pronouns means that Yahweh is one, He is one person even though that's the purpose of singular personal pronouns.
The problem is even worse than that in John chapter 3, Jesus describes how the children of God are those who are begotten of the Spirit. If we're begotten of the Spirit, that means in trinity rule we were begotten by the third person of the trinity. How come he's not our Father how come the first person of the trinity ends up being their Father. You got the same problem all over again so now we got three fathers, we got our natural earthly father, we got the third person of the trinity as our Father and we got God the Father as our Father. Just like Jesus three fathers it's stupid and ridiculous, actually Christians only have one Father because even our natural father and the children have died to that life. We died to it if we're born again and now we have a new father a new life. As born-again we have died to our old life and we are born again into a new life. Our new Father is Father Yahweh, but in Trinity world you got three.
The Bible tells us we were born of the Spirit, begotten of the spirit, spirit begets spirit and so the third person of the Trinity begets us. The third person of the trinity father's us, he gives us a new birth/life. That necessarily means the third person of the trinity is our father that would be the case if the trinity was actually true. Fortunately the trinity doctrine is not true. The Holy Spirit is our holy Father Yahweh's Spirit. The Spirit is a Holy Spirit because our Father Yahweh is holy and so His Spirit is Holy and we are born anew, begotten again by the power of our Father Yahweh's Holy Spirit. It's pretty simple and Trinitarians actually know it. When you debate the trinitarians about it they don't want to admit it because they have extreme difficulty being honest with themselves, and the reason they have extreme difficulty being honest with themselves is because the doctrine of the trinity teaches them to be dishonest with themselves. It's a tutor of lies, because to defend this doctrine you have to be disingenuous, you can't be honest with yourself because it'll fall apart and so you're kind of taught in trinity world the most important thing is to defend the trinity.
You're not taught that the most important thing is to be truthful, and so you see how that can happen. You end up with these ridiculous implications. You got to start having these weird thoughts in your head and mental gymnastics to try to make something like this to work. What you might think okay God the Father sent His Spirit and you're thinking that it's just His Spirit it's not a third person, but you're using the language of the Trinity. You might think you're resolving this and all you're doing is talking yourself into stupidity. The facts will remain. The doctrine of the trinity says Jesus has three fathers and the children of God have three fathers, by implication of the doctrine of the trinity it's absolutely absurd. It can't be avoided by you dreaming up excuses, you're still gonna have the fact that the children of God are begotten of the third person of the Trinity. Who ever begets someone is the father and that's why translators will translate Abraham begat Isaac as Abraham fathered Isaac. That means if the spirit begets the children of Yahweh, the spirit fathers the children of Yahweh. It is no problem if that's the Father's Spirit the same person. Now it's a big problem if it's another person distinct from the Father, because in the trinity the Father is not the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit is not the Father. In the trinity doctrine you have the Holy Spirit fathering the children of God, the Holy Spirit fathering Jesus but somehow the first person of the trinity and not the third person ends up being the Father. Same with the children of Father Yahweh the third person begets Jesus, third person of the trinity begets the children of Yahweh, spirit begets spirit, but somehow the first person of the Trinity ends up being the Father of Jesus and the Father of the children of Yahweh, what a mess.
The Trinity doctrine has made an utter stinky rotten filthy mess out of the truth it's an attempt by evil to turn the truth of God into a big ugly lie and to defeat the victory of the children of God. Revelation say the devil has deceived the whole earth If you're a reasonable person, and a lot of people think Christianity is about being unreasonable, you've got to stop this and realize this is pretty weird, how am I going to explain this thing about the many fathers. If you are a trinitarian there will be things which will be difficult to explain, but if you are not you are actually free to quote any scripture, because you don't have to read into the bible your assumption. You can quote directly from the word of Yahweh without translating it or make any assumptions, every thing will fall in place. Yahweh bless you with an open mind and heart for Him.
This article is from the video below – please watch the video.
The Bible says spirit begets spirit and flesh begets flesh so how did the spirit begets the flesh baby Jesus? You see and that's where they sort of corner themselves because they start arguing that way in a corner. On the flipside and on the other extreme end you'll have a situation where trinitarians are cornered into admitting Jesus had three fathers, and that happens when they start pointing out that the Holy Spirit begat baby Jesus. Because the Bible says that and once they've admitted that, being begotten means being fathered, which it does. The Holy Spirit begats baby Jesus, they kind of catch themselves once in a while. They have the Holy Spirit fathering Jesus and they have the third person of the trinity as Jesus father and they have the first person of the trinity as Jesus father. Then they end up with Joseph being Jesus adopted father. See John 6:42
It's hard to sort of even imagine what goes on in the trinitarian mind when it comes to this question because it gets very strange, the Bible says that baby Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit or begotten out of the Holy Spirit in Matt 1:18 and Luke 1:35. The word begotten might not be in some of your translations but it's in the Greek, see Luke 1:35. When you see the opening words of Matthew for example, Abraham begat Isaac, Isaac begat Jacob, Jacob begat Judah, and so on. You'll see some translations translate that as Abraham fathered Isaac, Isaac fathered Jacob, Jacob fathered Judah etc and that essentially captures what the word begat or begotten means. It means to procreate or be the pro creator of the one responsible for giving birth to from the father's perspective. When the Bible says the Holy Spirit begat Jesus and you're a trinitarian you have the third person of the trinity as the father of Jesus which makes no sense. Because in trinity world in your own doctrine you don't believe that the Holy Spirit is the father of Jesus, yet the Bible says the Holy Spirit fathered Jesus.
The only way this is going to make sense is, if the Holy Spirit isn't a separate third person and the Holy Spirit is simply the Father's spirit. Now those passages are going to make sense if you say that Yahweh is the Father of Jesus even though the spirit begat or fathered baby Jesus. But as it is in trinity world you've got the third person of the trinity fathering Jesus so you can't escape the fact that, that means the Holy Spirit is the father of Jesus. Because you're in your trinitarian world and the Holy Spirit is a separate person from the Father, and then you've got Yahweh the Father as the Father of Jesus even though somebody else, the third person of the trinity fathered him, begot him. You see how that makes absolutely no sense at all. To end up with three fathers Joseph is the adopted father the Holy Spirit who begot him fathered him, and then somehow you have to admit that the Father Yahweh the first person in the trinity is the father of Jesus. You might also end up with Jesus began Jesus because in the trinity doctrine the three persons or so called persons are co equal and the same substance. If you're going to believe the Holy Spirit is a separate third person fathered Jesus or begot Jesus you got a huge problem on your hands.
I know what most Trinitarians do, they go weird in their heads, they start thinking about a solution to this problem an excuse and instead of saying you know this is a serious problem. I got to check this out to see what's going on here, instead of doing that, their first reaction most of the time with most people is to dream up an excuse and make something up. What they'll do is they'll use the language of the trinity, first person and the third person, but they'll try to describe it in the way that it really happened. It was the Father's Holy Spirit. His Holy Spirit is not a separate third person. Yahweh is who He is, He is Spirit and that is what the Father is. Our Holy Father is Holy Spirit and so they'll try to describe it with that truth by using trinitarian language. To try to get out of their problem it's kind of weird. What they do in their head is like they're admitting that they're wrong without admitting that they're wrong. It's kind of the same thing they do with the singular personal pronouns of Yahweh, they don't want to admit singular personal pronouns means that Yahweh is one, He is one person even though that's the purpose of singular personal pronouns.
The problem is even worse than that in John chapter 3, Jesus describes how the children of God are those who are begotten of the Spirit. If we're begotten of the Spirit, that means in trinity rule we were begotten by the third person of the trinity. How come he's not our Father how come the first person of the trinity ends up being their Father. You got the same problem all over again so now we got three fathers, we got our natural earthly father, we got the third person of the trinity as our Father and we got God the Father as our Father. Just like Jesus three fathers it's stupid and ridiculous, actually Christians only have one Father because even our natural father and the children have died to that life. We died to it if we're born again and now we have a new father a new life. As born-again we have died to our old life and we are born again into a new life. Our new Father is Father Yahweh, but in Trinity world you got three.
The Bible tells us we were born of the Spirit, begotten of the spirit, spirit begets spirit and so the third person of the Trinity begets us. The third person of the trinity father's us, he gives us a new birth/life. That necessarily means the third person of the trinity is our father that would be the case if the trinity was actually true. Fortunately the trinity doctrine is not true. The Holy Spirit is our holy Father Yahweh's Spirit. The Spirit is a Holy Spirit because our Father Yahweh is holy and so His Spirit is Holy and we are born anew, begotten again by the power of our Father Yahweh's Holy Spirit. It's pretty simple and Trinitarians actually know it. When you debate the trinitarians about it they don't want to admit it because they have extreme difficulty being honest with themselves, and the reason they have extreme difficulty being honest with themselves is because the doctrine of the trinity teaches them to be dishonest with themselves. It's a tutor of lies, because to defend this doctrine you have to be disingenuous, you can't be honest with yourself because it'll fall apart and so you're kind of taught in trinity world the most important thing is to defend the trinity.
You're not taught that the most important thing is to be truthful, and so you see how that can happen. You end up with these ridiculous implications. You got to start having these weird thoughts in your head and mental gymnastics to try to make something like this to work. What you might think okay God the Father sent His Spirit and you're thinking that it's just His Spirit it's not a third person, but you're using the language of the Trinity. You might think you're resolving this and all you're doing is talking yourself into stupidity. The facts will remain. The doctrine of the trinity says Jesus has three fathers and the children of God have three fathers, by implication of the doctrine of the trinity it's absolutely absurd. It can't be avoided by you dreaming up excuses, you're still gonna have the fact that the children of God are begotten of the third person of the Trinity. Who ever begets someone is the father and that's why translators will translate Abraham begat Isaac as Abraham fathered Isaac. That means if the spirit begets the children of Yahweh, the spirit fathers the children of Yahweh. It is no problem if that's the Father's Spirit the same person. Now it's a big problem if it's another person distinct from the Father, because in the trinity the Father is not the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit is not the Father. In the trinity doctrine you have the Holy Spirit fathering the children of God, the Holy Spirit fathering Jesus but somehow the first person of the trinity and not the third person ends up being the Father. Same with the children of Father Yahweh the third person begets Jesus, third person of the trinity begets the children of Yahweh, spirit begets spirit, but somehow the first person of the Trinity ends up being the Father of Jesus and the Father of the children of Yahweh, what a mess.
The Trinity doctrine has made an utter stinky rotten filthy mess out of the truth it's an attempt by evil to turn the truth of God into a big ugly lie and to defeat the victory of the children of God. Revelation say the devil has deceived the whole earth If you're a reasonable person, and a lot of people think Christianity is about being unreasonable, you've got to stop this and realize this is pretty weird, how am I going to explain this thing about the many fathers. If you are a trinitarian there will be things which will be difficult to explain, but if you are not you are actually free to quote any scripture, because you don't have to read into the bible your assumption. You can quote directly from the word of Yahweh without translating it or make any assumptions, every thing will fall in place. Yahweh bless you with an open mind and heart for Him.
This article is from the video below – please watch the video.
Video by Brother Kel - http://www.angelfire.com/space/thegospeltruth/trinity.html
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